Comments on: The Best Health Care In The World?

By: Bryan

Bryan — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 06:08:10 +0000

The only reason for separating profit into different categories is to permit them to be taxed differently, which enables the establishment of economic privilege. The arithmetic, it isn’t involved enough to be called mathematics, and set up in a computer program are identical.

It is the artificial classifications that allow hedge fund mangers to pay a lower tax rate than a plumber. Capitalism requires a level playing field to work, and the laws are preventing it.

Capitalism is a great economic system. I wish we would try it.

By: Michael

Michael — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 05:34:03 +0000

Bryan, with respect, I view returns to capital as interest, returns to labor as wages, returns to privilege as rent, returns to risk as profit. I don’t want to sidetrack the conversation overmuch but I thought it would be helpful that we at least understand how we are each using these terms. The more simplified model of treating all resources as capital and all returns as profit has the benefit of being easier to work with because it is often very difficult to separate the factors of production, and more efficient to treat them as a unity — income from whatever source derived.

By: Bryan

Bryan — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 05:12:18 +0000

You at least have a general agreement that it’s necessary, Kryten, we’re still dealing with people who can’t see the problem because they haven’t been affected yet.

By: Kryten42

Kryten42 — Wed, 02 Apr 2008 03:54:13 +0000

It is obscene, and it isn’t at all right.

Nothing to add to what has already been said. Just letting you know how I feel about it also.

It’s broken here also, thanks to Bushmoron’s #1 asskisser, Howard. Not as bad as in the USA, but it will take time and pain to fix our system also. At least Rudd has said his new Gov will work on it. Problem here is, people want it all fixed *NOW DAMMIT!* of course! 🙂 But there is a lot to fix. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see.

Cheers.

By: Bryan

Bryan — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 20:13:35 +0000

Michael, I view capital as anything of value, and work has value. Profit is the condition where the capital invested is less than the capital returned. Gamblers aren’t the only people who can make a profit; a gambler being anyone who risks only money in the hopes of making more.

That’s the real issue, Badtux: are we ready to do what is necessary, or do more people have to die? The only thing lacking is the will to fix the problem.

By: Badtux

Badtux — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 18:51:43 +0000

Oregon has the money to pay for health care for all Oregonians. The deal is, they don’t want to pay for health care for all Oregonians. Because that would require (gasp) A TAX. So hundreds of Oregonians die each year due to lack of health care, part of an American Holocaust that kills 20,000+ Americans every year due to lack of health care, and, well, we can’t have a sales tax on durable goods to pay for health care because, well, just because, okay?!

As for “Medicare for All”, remember, this is America. Profits for millionaires are more important than the lives of 20,000 Americans killed by the health care mafia every year. I mean, c’mon. We’re talking about our God here — the almighty Dollar — which of course is worth more than the lives of those 20,000 Americans who are killed each year by the health insurance mafia. Too bad for those 20,000 Americans, they shoulda been born millionaires like Bill Frist, eh?!

— Badtux the Snarky Penguin

By: Michael

Michael — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 05:59:06 +0000

I agree about not starting unnecessary fights, we do not need to go further than we can achieve consensus.

By: Michael

Michael — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 05:58:16 +0000

You use that word profit in a way that is not quite what the word means in economics, though. Wages are not profits, they are return on labor. You may risk losing your job if you do it badly, but you don’t risk a financial loss on your job, you expect to be paid regularly and on time.

By: Bryan

Bryan — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 04:33:17 +0000

Michael, a paycheck is the “profit” a worker receives for doing a job. There is nothing wrong with profiting from a job well done. The majority of health care providers are small businesses, not corporations, and they actually have to do something to earn a living.

In general, the actual health care providers are also being screwed in the current system. They provide services based on the assumption that the health insurance companies will pay them, and then, all too often, the insurers later decide that what was done wasn’t covered.

I see no reason to start a fight with doctors when the problem is insurance companies. The health care providers should be allies in this battle, as they are also victims of the system.

By: Michael

Michael — Tue, 01 Apr 2008 04:04:23 +0000

Socialized medicine, fine. Horrors. You want to buy a private plan, they should still be available and maybe they can cover more of the elective stuff and so forth. Supplemental.